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Round #3 AAr's

SlySniper

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So far, this might be one of the best fights in the Tournament



I even had to pick up leatherfaces battle in this one, I am so impressed with how the challengers performed in this battle. I feel they shine above the Leapord tanks for sure.
 
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I am so impressed with how the challengers performed
They did perform well no doubt. Mine shrugged off a handful of hits. The Leopards are able to do the same - front on. The key to this battle was the terrain.

I saw that the area the enemy was going to enter had lots of terrain features of its own but I realized that between the main ridge from my back right towards the front left and the hill in my far left side gave me a place to hide and try to create favorable match ups. Lets face it, the Brits were seriously out numbered so they had to find a way to prevent a head on fight with the attackers.

So my plan was to have observers on high ground so I could get an intel advantage, keep my tanks hidden behind terrain features. Some of those observers also had Javelins so they could take out targets too. The other half of the Javelins I positioned so if the attack progressed they would be exposed to them. Then I engineered my engagements so that one group of tanks would engage and then withdraw behind the terrain and another group of tanks on the other side of the map would popup and be able to target the sides and rear of the enemy.

It worked very very well.

So, when my Challenger tanks were hit they were front on and often hull down but when they hit back, they had ample side shot and rear shots to take. In that way I was able to create an unfair fight form the first engagement. I did take some losses though. I may have gotten the highest Brit score but I took more casualties than other Brit victors. Overall I was pretty happy with my gunners. I also made heavy use of the hull down command. Like every turn. I re-positioned tanks constantly. I even got a few moments where I moved locations and nailed the attacker who was trying to our maneuver my tank. Really the battle started in my favour and I managed to keep the momentum. There were a few turns in the middle after I too loses where I was concerned. My group of tanks on the hill got down to only one tank - nail biting moments there.

Infantry I positioned to be ale to move on objectives as needed and try to let them engage any enemy infantry and IFVs they could.
 
I have enjoyed all of these tournament matches, but this one spoke to me. It's rare to have tanks and mech infantry with enough room to maneuver on a CM map, so I immediately viewed the 'empty corner' and left flank as being highly preferable for a syrian/german mech assault. I broke left early and never stopped moving. I isolated pockets of resistance and went around them. I feel like this was maybe the first time in CM that I ever achieved a 'strategic' surprise. I say this because almost everything in CM boils down to tactics and sure, we all surprise each other in combat a little. I mean 'strategic' in that I do not believe my oppo expected me to assault that fast and hard up that flank. Evidence is that one LEO broke over the berm and clipped 3 warriors with one shell. I now truly understand the meaning of 'enfilade'.

I also could not get over the German Artillery. So fast and accurate! I dropped 480 artillery rounds in 25 minutes. I considered it to be a challenge to drop it all. In many ways German 155 was the star of the show for me. The way he was nailing my armor, I thought my oppo had 20 javelin teams and was shocked to see he only had a few. I was dropping 155 all over his positions to suppress those bad boys.

I have great respect for my oppo, who is funny, friendly and fast with turns. He punished my aggression and mistakes severely. Renzo Gracie used to tell us that "some days you are the hammer and other days you are the nail'. On the day I get nailed, I hope I can fight with the skill and courage KGPanther did in this match.

My love was surely raining down on him...

 
I had the Syrian's vs @Raging Al and it did not go exactly how I planned it. Speaking of my plan, it went something like this. First let me say SF2 is the title I play the least of, so I was not sure how the Chally's and Leo's would match up. So I made a target range map to test them a lil bit. Roughly the size of the map we were playing. I gave each side a berm to get some hull down cover behind. I set some Chally's on 1 side and Leo's on the other. I set them up and let the Tac AI bang away at each other for about 3turns. On the basis of this test it seemed at distance the tanks would be a more or less even match for each other. Using this info I made my plan.

As far as I remember the briefing told me I had a numerical edge in armor, but they had a Javelin section and a bunch of air support. The Jav section was my biggest worry I knew at long distance I would never see them before they launched a missile. My second concern was enemy air support. I came up with the plan to stay in my deployment zone for a good portion of the beginning of the game since there was enough terrain changes I could get most of my force hull down to the areas of the map I expected him to be in. This would hopefully allow me to spot javelin launches and have plenty of units to return fire on the team. The Javelin section was made of 4 teams with a total of 12 missiles, I knew I would not be able to stop the first javelin launched from his teams which of course a launched javelin means i am about to have one of my tanks die but I hoped I could gang up on the team that launched it and kill them before a second launch. If I could have done some horse trading before the game I would happily scratched 5 tanks maybe 6 from my line up in exchange for the entire jav section. Staying in place like this I hoped would allow the same principle to be used on his Chally's. I figured to gang up on them when spotted and hopefully KO a couple. Staying together like this I hoped might allow my air defense to protect my force a lil better. I did not plan on leaving until I stopped seeing things to shoot at or some kind of enemy fire made me leave. When I did leave I planned on keeping my force together and going straight at the enemy, hopefully breaking is line of defense and rolling it up.

Below is a pic of roughly how I expected the defense to be set up
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Unless I saw something in game to change my mind this is roughly how I wanted to attack it.
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I figured I would use my numbers like a hammer. Break his defense and then roll it up, not worrying to much about the objectives till the end of the game. When ideally most of his force would be smoking wrecks and scattered shell shocked infantry and would not put up much of a fight for the terrain. When I left my set up zone I did not really plan on stopping until I got to the far edge of the map. Maybe a quick stop where the first arrows end to re-organize maybe push some scouts out ahead adjust arty or smoke to cover my open left flank and rear. There was nothing subtle about the plan. I had a bigger force I wanted to keep it together to overwhelm the enemy when I spotted them. I thought this played best to my strength and at the same time gave me the best chance and limiting the damage the javs would do and give me a chance to limit damage from air support...... I felt good about the ideal...

Here is a quick vid that is meant to be a metaphor for how the game went


After the beating was over and I started trying to piece together what went wrong. 3 key things stuck out.

1- I could not really see that much of the enemy force. though he was having no trouble seeing me judging by the incoming fire he was hitting me every turn while I was in my deployment zone.

2- When I did see the enemy and get a shot at them, most of the time my guys missed. Not near misses that do damage and make the enemy react, NO my guys would miss the entire map, or be dozens of meters short....

3- When I did hit the enemy I did absolutely no damage at all that I could tell. On top of which I watched several 155 arty shells bounce off his tanks which looked good but did not seem to bother them at all. They would hold their ground and keep shooting my guys.

Obviously at the end of a CM game and when you talk about the enemy and say things like "can't see'em, can't hit'em and can't hurt'em".... You are going to get crushed, and I got completely crushed this game...... I have no ideal why my guys could not see the enemy that was banging away on them. I dont know why my guys could not hit them when they shot at them.... but it was some of the worst gunnery I have ever seen in a CM game. My guys could not hurt them when they did hit them. I did not expect many long range KOs but I did expect some main gun damage or damage to subsystems or immobilizations. But no... I could not seem to scratch the paint on his units.... Meanwhile he was killing mine.

@RagingAL is a great oppo that has beat my ass twice, maybe one of these days I will be able to get even with him..

That is my story and I am sticking to it....
 
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After the beating was over and I started trying to piece together what went wrong. 3 key things stuck out.

1- I could not really see that much of the enemy force. though he was having no trouble seeing me judging by the incoming fire he was hitting me every turn while I was in my deployment zone.

2- When I did see the enemy and get a shot at them, most of the time my guys missed. Not near misses that do damage and make the enemy react, NO my guys would miss the entire map, or be dozens of meters short....

3- When I did hit the enemy I did absolutely no damage at all that I could tell. On top of which I watched several 155 arty shells bounce off his tanks which looked good but did not seem to bother them at all. They would hold their ground and keep shooting my guys.

Obviously at the end of a CM game and when you talk about the enemy and say things like "can't see'em, can't hit'em and can't hurt'em".... You are going to get crushed, and I got completely crushed this game...... I have no ideal why my guys could not see the enemy that was banging away on them. I dont know why my guys could not hit them when they shot at them.... but it was some of the worst gunnery I have ever seen in a CM game. My guys could not hurt them when they did hit them. I did not expect many long range KOs but I did expect some main gun damage or damage to subsystems or immobilizations. But no... I could not seem to scratch the paint on his units.... Meanwhile he was killing mine.

@RagingAL is a great oppo that has beat my ass twice, maybe one of these days I will be able to get even with him..

That is my story and I am sticking to it....
Haha great AAR, @Shady Side, and pretty much sums it up perfectly. I got very lucky in this battle, thanks to the ability of the Challengers to shrug off most hits to the front turret. I got clumsy twice and lost two tanks which exposed their hulls and got KO'd with first time hull penetrations; keeping the rest hull down was crucial to survival.

This tank, part of the troop holding my extreme left flank, lead a particularly charmed life as you can see by the six hit decals around the gun mount before taking a hit on the actual gun barrel towards the end of the game.......

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Another survived three direct hits from 155 arty and three AP hits around the gun mount for the loss of his 12.7mm MG and a few cases of tinitus!

Very happy with the final score, but i did feel sorry for Shady.

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lol @ the F&cking challys! I bet that tank crew that took six APFSDS to the face were, um, a little unnerved. lol. They might have needed a cup of cocoa and some new eardrums to resume fighting. That has to be like sitting in the liberty bell whilst the world strongest man whacks it with a sledge hammer. It can’t be good. Poor shady !!
 
but i did feel sorry for Shady.

Poor shady !!

Y'all dont know half the story......... around the time the tourney game started i started a CW game vs another buddy of mine... i was attacking with the Rooskies on a small-ish map... and my tank gunners were worse marksmen then my Leos were in this game by a country mile.......... they would shoot everything except the target...they missed high... they missed low.... left right and center.... and then got shot by they just had missed.......... but that is how CM goes for me

a couple weeks me and the same guy started another CW game..... with me having the US........ for the first 15or20 turns.... I have TOWs 1 shot killing T-64's deep in tree lines form almost 2km....... M-60s 1 shot killing T-64s at some range....... i am watching his BMPs constantly missing my M-113... that are spending turn after turn bouncing 50cal ammo off them... Dragons almost at the end of their range getting kills.......

we had been chatting a lil about the game talking about all my one shot kills on T-64s .. without gettinghim a spot on what killed them and how his guys probably would not shoot straight enough to kill them if he seen me..................................

i keep telling him this game has a VERY WEIRD vibe for me.............. but it also explains why most of my CM oppos seem happy most of the time while we have a game going.................... like is this how games go for y'all....... here i was thinking how hard and frustrating CM can be....... but it dont have to be that way??

but i am still fairly confident i will get nuked by the end of the game......... it is still a CM game... i am still Shady...... I know how these stories end.....
 
Game ended this week against Cargol.
Even if a very small minor victory is granted to me by the AI, which is obviously a fan of Queen Elizabeth (I had the English), there is no doubt that with a few more turns, Cargol would have taken all its objectives, it had more than double that remaining tank than me. It was a very good game.
Cargoll was quickly pinned down by my Javelins and Challengers firing from heights. The Javelin teams were quickly spotted and partly destroyed, as were my helicopters. Half of my infantry, supported by 1 or 2 nearby challengers, were waiting on the slopes of the hills for the objectives, so my men were well in front of my defense system. At the end of the game there were only 2 surviving soldiers left, but some enemy tanks died with them. In the last turn 4 of my men with RPGs were crawling less than 20 m from a Leopard stopped behind the top of an objective...
The Challengers and the Leopards took the hits well, I couldn't tell which was the best.
Thanks to Cargol for this epic part.
 
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Game ended this week against Cargol.
Even if a very small minor victory is granted to me by the AI, which is obviously a fan of Queen Elizabeth (I had the English), there is no doubt that with a few more turns, Cargol would have taken all its objectives, it had more than double that remaining tank than me. It was a very good game.
Cargoll was quickly pinned down by my Javelins and Challengers firing from heights. The Javelin teams were quickly spotted and partly destroyed, as were my helicopters. Half of my infantry, supported by 1 or 2 nearby challengers, were waiting on the slopes of the hills for the objectives, so my men were well in front of my defense system. At the end of the game there were only 2 surviving soldiers left, but some enemy tanks died with them. In the last turn 4 of my men with RPGs were crawling less than 20 m from a Leopard stopped behind the top of an objective...
The Challengers and the Leopards took the hits well, I couldn't tell which was the best.
Thanks to Cargol for this epic part.

You might have been spent, but you did enough to slow Cargol on his attack. SO you won with the help of the Time.

Part of the challenge is learning to be effiecient with ones time. In a battle where time is not a factor, the side with a major advantage will always generally win in a cm battle.

But having to compare your results to 10 other players trying to do the same thing in a given time span. How quickly one can do the task becomes one of the factors as to how skilled one is.


And when players say time should not be a factor, that is a incorrect concept. In real combat, the quicker one can run a operation, the less time it provides for a enemy to organize and react to your actions. It creates a momentum of actions, learning to grab and keep momentum and not letting a attack stall out is a skill at times.
 
Somewhat late to the party.
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Analyzing the terrain and the mission, I've concluded that the only approach was to hit my enemy on the flank, while he was on the move towards his assigned objectives and/or firing positions. Armored group of 6 tanks was dedicated to that task. Rest (5 tanks) occupied hull down positions.

Two minutes into the battle, a ferocious tank engagement happened. It lasted 2 minutes, I lost two tanks, my opponent 12 or 13 (can't remember).
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The blow was significant, but not decisive. After overcoming the initial crisis, my opponent wedged in, forming an armored fist. Such a maneuver enabled him to defeat my force in detail (I believe this is the correct Western term). When the timer ran out, not much was left on the battlefield. It was a good armored slugfest @Probus!
 
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