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Operation Konrad - Rules Thread

HEADS UP!!! TWO IMPORTANT THINGS!!

THING ONE:
I did update the rules after some additional play-testing and getting ready for Round 1. The big one is that the Budapest battles will start as Soviet PROBES, instead of Attacks.

Current Version: 10.0 April 18, 2023
*Budapest battles changed from Soviet Attacks to Soviet Probes. Further play-testing confirmed that even with recent map changes, the Attacks were going to be cake-walks for the Soviets. Keep in mind that Budapest held out until after Konrad I-III operations were over, so this should not be easy for the Soviets.
*Clarified that German Armored Infantry "SPG" in Table 6 includes Wespe, Hummel, Grille, Marder
*Excluded naval artillery in Table 6B, as we are a bit far from the coast :)
*Made explicit that pre-planned artillery and air may not be used in Meeting Engagement or Attacker set-up zones (No D-bag rule).

THING TWO:
For Round 1, units that achieve a victory will not be subject to the >60% casualty loss rule.
Originally, I added this rule in the design to keep Attackers from being unrealistically aggressive, but further testing (and some commentary) has convinced me that on these maps, this Round, there's no way around this and the rule hurts the Germans more than intended. This certainly favors the German side, but if there is a Round that should favor the Germans, it is Round 1 due to the operational surprise achieved.
This first round is a bit of an experiment. The biggest challenge with this project has been trying to achieve an elusive combination of balance while using historical maps & situations which can be inherently unbalanced. If I err on balance in my rules and the Germans lose every battle, they lose a big portion of their armored force and the campaign will quickly die. If I err the other direction and the Germans win every battle easily, then this generally reflects history but has less long-term impact on the Soviets. I will revisit this after Round 1.

If either one of these changes affects your Round 1 strategy and you need more time to reconsider, let me know. Otherwise, alter your Deployment Matrix orders and give me the thumbs up when you are ready.

@Brille @Spoogles @Drifter Man @Gorst @Aurelius @dkchapuis @Guardsman @jackal @Car88 @Bleskaceq @Cargol @Monty's Mighty Moustache
 
OnePingOnly said:
HEADS UP!!! TWO IMPORTANT THINGS!!

THING ONE:
I did update the rules after some additional play-testing and getting ready for Round 1. The big one is that the Budapest battles will start as Soviet PROBES, instead of Attacks.

Current Version: 10.0 April 18, 2023
*Budapest battles changed from Soviet Attacks to Soviet Probes. Further play-testing confirmed that even with recent map changes, the Attacks were going to be cake-walks for the Soviets. Keep in mind that Budapest held out until after Konrad I-III operations were over, so this should not be easy for the Soviets.
*Clarified that German Armored Infantry "SPG" in Table 6 includes Wespe, Hummel, Grille, Marder
*Excluded naval artillery in Table 6B, as we are a bit far from the coast :)
*Made explicit that pre-planned artillery and air may not be used in Meeting Engagement or Attacker set-up zones (No D-bag rule).

THING TWO:
For Round 1, units that achieve a victory will not be subject to the >60% casualty loss rule.
Originally, I added this rule in the design to keep Attackers from being unrealistically aggressive, but further testing (and some commentary) has convinced me that on these maps, this Round, there's no way around this and the rule hurts the Germans more than intended. This certainly favors the German side, but if there is a Round that should favor the Germans, it is Round 1 due to the operational surprise achieved.
This first round is a bit of an experiment. The biggest challenge with this project has been trying to achieve an elusive combination of balance while using historical maps & situations which can be inherently unbalanced. If I err on balance in my rules and the Germans lose every battle, they lose a big portion of their armored force and the campaign will quickly die. If I err the other direction and the Germans win every battle easily, then this generally reflects history but has less long-term impact on the Soviets. I will revisit this after Round 1.

If either one of these changes affects your Round 1 strategy and you need more time to reconsider, let me know. Otherwise, alter your Deployment Matrix orders and give me the thumbs up when you are ready.

@Brille @Spoogles @Drifter Man @Gorst @Aurelius @dkchapuis @Guardsman @jackal @Car88 @Bleskaceq @Cargol @Monty's Mighty Moustache
Click to expand...
All the Budapest maps are currently ATK maps, are you going to update them to be Probe maps?
 
OnePingOnly said:
*Made explicit that pre-planned artillery and air may not be used in Meeting Engagement or Attacker set-up zones (No D-bag rule).
Click to expand...
Looking at the rule, there seems to be a contradiction:

Pre-Planned Artillery & Air
a. Attackers may use pre-planned artillery and Air for Attack and Probe battles
b. Both sides may use pre-planned artillery and air for Meeting Engagements, however pre-planned artillery and air may NOT fire into Attacker or Meeting Engagement set-up zones.

a. implies that defenders cannot use pre-planner artillery.
b. implies that they can, they just aren't allowed to shoot into the attacker set-up zones. Or possibly, b. is specific to Meeting Engagements only, in which case it is not clear why the attacker set-up zone is mentioned.

So, is the defender allowed to use pre-planned artillery?
By the way, you can't control air assets in CMRT, they act independently of your control - they arrive when they want and attack what they want.
 
Drifter Man said:
(y)
The German Deployment Matrix is ready.
Click to expand...

480ebc56b3ef355b3b84e42e00a3071a.jpg
 
Drifter Man said:
Looking at the rule, there seems to be a contradiction:

Pre-Planned Artillery & Air
a. Attackers may use pre-planned artillery and Air for Attack and Probe battles
b. Both sides may use pre-planned artillery and air for Meeting Engagements, however pre-planned artillery and air may NOT fire into Attacker or Meeting Engagement set-up zones.

a. implies that defenders cannot use pre-planner artillery.
b. implies that they can, they just aren't allowed to shoot into the attacker set-up zones. Or possibly, b. is specific to Meeting Engagements only, in which case it is not clear why the attacker set-up zone is mentioned.

So, is the defender allowed to use pre-planned artillery?
By the way, you can't control air assets in CMRT, they act independently of your control - they arrive when they want and attack what they want.
Click to expand...
I think what he means is that everyone in all battle types can use pre-planned artillery outside of the opponent's set-up zone, but only the attacker in attack or probe battles can target inside the opponent's set-up zone.

The question I have is whether the prohibition on artillery in set-up zones expires after a set amount of time or if it's for the whole battle.
 
Drifter Man said:
Looking at the rule, there seems to be a contradiction:

Pre-Planned Artillery & Air
a. Attackers may use pre-planned artillery and Air for Attack and Probe battles
b. Both sides may use pre-planned artillery and air for Meeting Engagements, however pre-planned artillery and air may NOT fire into Attacker or Meeting Engagement set-up zones.

a. implies that defenders cannot use pre-planner artillery.
b. implies that they can, they just aren't allowed to shoot into the attacker set-up zones. Or possibly, b. is specific to Meeting Engagements only, in which case it is not clear why the attacker set-up zone is mentioned.

So, is the defender allowed to use pre-planned artillery?
By the way, you can't control air assets in CMRT, they act independently of your control - they arrive when they want and attack what they want.
Click to expand...
Gorst said:
I think what he means is that everyone in all battle types can use pre-planned artillery outside of the opponent's set-up zone, but only the attacker in attack or probe battles can target inside the opponent's set-up zone.

The question I have is whether the prohibition on artillery in set-up zones expires after a set amount of time or if it's for the whole battle.
Click to expand...
Probably sould wait for the GM to sort this out however ill add my two cents.

I would interpret this to mean that in attacks and probes, only attackers can preplan as if this was NOT the case there would have been no need for bullet A. Bullet b starts with
Both sides may use pre-planned artillery and air for Meeting Engagements,
Click to expand...
So its probably the case that only in ME(s) can both sides use pre-planned.
 
Sorry, gents. I am genuinely unsure of why I edited this at all, or what problem I was trying to solve. :unsure:

It should say the following:
1) Pre-Planned Artillery & Air :
a. Attackers may use pre-planned artillery and Air for Attack and Probe battles
b. Both sides may use pre-planned artillery and air for Meeting Engagements, however pre-planned artillery may NOT fire into set-up zones.

The only change from 9.0, then, is removal of the restriction on air support firing into set-up zones....because you can't control it.

As to time limits on firing into ME set-up zones, I'm going to pass on setting a timer. It's all a bit hard to officiate anyway, and there may be some maps where a side chooses to remain in the set-up zone because that's where a good OP or firing position happens to lie. After a point, it should be fair game - just not at the start.
 
One further question @OnePingOnly , with no time limit for the shelling of setup zones how do we manage it if someone feels that it was too early? Do they raise something or are you planning to police it in any way? Not that I want to add to your burden as you've done more than enough work but I can see it getting messy if we leave it to people's subjective judgements.
 
Personally, I've never had an issue with this. We don't need to regulate and codify everything. People have common sense.
My own thinking about attacker and ME setup zones is this:
  • Don't shoot at the setup zone (using artillery or anything else)
  • Certainly don't shoot at the setup zone with the aim to kill massed reserve units that your opponent is keeping there. It's not fair.
  • If you see (not just hear or assume) an enemy unit shooting at you from the setup zone or that is otherwise an immediate threat to you, you can target that specific place. Any collateral damage is your opponent's responsibility in this case.
  • If the battle advances so far that you are able to enter your opponent's setup zone, that's fine, go ahead with your attack.
  • If you are on the other side of this question, keep in mind that mistakes happen, shells fall too long and AI units pick their own targets. Disperse your units, give them hide orders, ensure they are not vulnerable while waiting in the setup zone for their turn.
 
Drifter Man said:
Personally, I've never had an issue with this. We don't need to regulate and codify everything. People have common sense.
My own thinking about attacker and ME setup zones is this:
  • Don't shoot at the setup zone (using artillery or anything else)
  • Certainly don't shoot at the setup zone with the aim to kill massed reserve units that your opponent is keeping there. It's not fair.
  • If you see (not just hear or assume) an enemy unit shooting at you from the setup zone or that is otherwise an immediate threat to you, you can target that specific place. Any collateral damage is your opponent's responsibility in this case.
  • If the battle advances so far that you are able to enter your opponent's setup zone, that's fine, go ahead with your attack.
  • If you are on the other side of this question, keep in mind that mistakes happen, shells fall too long and AI units pick their own targets. Disperse your units, give them hide orders, ensure they are not vulnerable while waiting in the setup zone for their turn.
Click to expand...
All sounds sensible. It's never happened to me either but I thought I'd ask just so it has at least been considered.
 
dkchapuis said:
Is there anything in the rules about overtime? Or is each side expected to CF after turn 29 in order to stop at turn 30?

(thats me again not reading the rules completely)
Click to expand...
Great question- the rules are silent in this.

In other tourneys where everyone is playing the same map, extra time can introduce unwanted variance in comparing the outcomes.
In this case, any OT should be played out. I will update the rules accordingly.

As a practical matter, my maps designed from scratch have no OT built in (incl. all of the Budapest maps). Modified maps appear to retain their original programming, regardless of whether I change them, so results will vary.
 
Minor rules changes made:
*Clarified QB Purchasing: Additional formations can be purchased from same or "lesser" force types - i.e., "Infantry" or "Armored Infantry" when your Core unit is "Armored Infantry"
*StuG III (Latest) is allowed in StuG formations. StuG III (Concrete) is still excluded. There were plenty of StuG IIIs meeting CM's "Latest" configuration that were present for Op Konrad.

Also, I codified the prior rules changes made for Round 2 around battle type, and when a unit is destroyed.

Getting ready for Round 3!!!!
 
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