Sure, there will be room for 3 players a side. Or you can withdraw if you want, it's up to you. Or you can just act as CO viva PzC 
Has anyone played a campaign using noob's 'Panzer Campaign' combo?
- Thread starter Nathangun
- Start date
No problem mate, if it wasn't for the work you put into this site I wouldn't have the means to play this, thanks again.
Here's a screenie of the Allied OOB, which will make things easier in the long run (I hope).
C
Cargol
Guest
Is the Allied OOB the same with the one you posted in post #21?
@nathangun
@nathangun
Yes, with minor alterations. The air support to be precise. I'm off to work now, will finish the Axis OOB when I get home then start the amended rules.
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poesel71
Guest
I'd like to add that we usually have no objectives on the map and there are no points for friendly or enemy casualties. Battles end with one side retreating or surrendering. Hmm, I just noticed that so far an attack has always succeeded. But I'd rather have it that the players decide who has won than CM.
In such OP games where each man is accounted for it is all about attrition and gaining or holding ground. CM points do not transfer back to PzC.
In such OP games where each man is accounted for it is all about attrition and gaining or holding ground. CM points do not transfer back to PzC.
Thanks for advice poesel.
I was thinking of making the battles 40 min instead of 60, plus having an objective. I think this will make it harder on the attacker.
I was thinking of making the battles 40 min instead of 60, plus having an objective. I think this will make it harder on the attacker.
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poesel71
Guest
Ok. FYI - our battles usually last 2h (the PzC) minus the time the first attackers need to reach the target hex (same rule for reinforcements). So battles last about 80-100 minutes. That makes for quite a different game obviously. Down side is that the battles take a long time to resolve.
I didn't realize the battles where so long. I thought they where sixty minute battles.
If you had a say, how long would you make the battles last?
If you had a say, how long would you make the battles last?
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poesel71
Guest
Hmm, main reason for the 2h battles was that PzC turns are 2h. The long duration certainly favours the attacker but that is the point of the OP level - to create battles which you can't loose.
I'm not saying these are bad games. Managing a retreat is quite interesting and a nice change from the usual. But some battles are too one sided to be fun.
If you want to be realistic 2h is the way to go. The map has the size of a PzC hex so it's quite big. Lot's of room for manoeuvring.
Personally I would rather have a more condensed battle - smaller size, less time. But then you get a disconnect from PzC and everything is more difficult to set up.
IMHO if you use PzC for the OP you should stick to its rules. Use other rules if you want other battles.
I'm not saying these are bad games. Managing a retreat is quite interesting and a nice change from the usual. But some battles are too one sided to be fun.
If you want to be realistic 2h is the way to go. The map has the size of a PzC hex so it's quite big. Lot's of room for manoeuvring.
Personally I would rather have a more condensed battle - smaller size, less time. But then you get a disconnect from PzC and everything is more difficult to set up.
IMHO if you use PzC for the OP you should stick to its rules. Use other rules if you want other battles.
P
poesel71
Guest
My CO Fred (Kuderian) asked me to point you to our DAR thread on the BFC forum. If you have questions (especially the PzC side) he'll be glad to answer them.
Axis DAR:
http://www.battlefront.com/community/showthread.php?t=110516
Allied DAR:
http://www.battlefront.com/community/showthread.php?t=110337
Axis DAR:
http://www.battlefront.com/community/showthread.php?t=110516
Allied DAR:
http://www.battlefront.com/community/showthread.php?t=110337
Thanks Poesel, I will check them out.
F
Fizou
Guest
I'm very fond of the PzC and CM combination. At the moment I'm playing a Sicily operation with poesel71 and others over at the BF forum.
I'm looking forward to following this unfold
I'm looking forward to following this unfold
F
Fizou
Guest
Just a few thoughts from me:
Picking the PzC scenario: Is a really crucial part as it determines what the experience will be like. The one we choose for our Sicily campaign is pretty lopsided, even after the changes that we made to the editor (cutting back on allied strength). We will definitely be more careful about our selection next time around.
Both sides should have an interesting OOB and a reasonable chance to win the scenario. Having a look at the PzC OOB it’s also a good idea to do some initial changes to get better balance for CM battles. Nathangun suggested reduced tank numbers which I think is a good idea. Artillery should also be looked at.
One way to go is to reduce numbers to try and have a very equal force on each side, another way is to reduce numbers but still keep the force ratio of the original PzC scenario intact. I would probably opt for the latter. The scenario length should also be considered as it will take some time to complete (our Sicily campaign is 11 PzC turns which feels reasonable).
Battle length: We have so far gone with an upper time limit of the PzC turn (2h) which then is reduced by the time it takes for the units to move to the battlefield. In the battle that we are about to commence right now the German force moved 4 hexes (4km) during their movement phase up to their jump off point. The specific units move a 12 km/h so 20 minutes are expended moving into position (battle length is 1:40h).
Most battles so far have been about 1h long. If the defending force is not strong enough it will try to withdraw of map, which it’s allowed to do after 30 minutes of combat (in our version of the rules). If the attacker is strong enough and destroys the defender, the battle will obviously end. If both sides are strong enough, the battle will last until times up or if both sides decide to cease fire. We have yet to see the latter happen as our main elements haven’t come into contact yet.
If a battle ends by cease fire or if time is up then the hex will continue to be contested and it will continue during the next assault phase with deployment zones matching the end of the last battle etc (of coruse presuming that one side doesnt move away during the movement phase, or decides not to attack during the assault phase).
An important addition is that if the defenders feels a given assault is to lopsided, no fun etc, then we have it resolved by PzC. But in this case the defending PzC unit’s defense value is lowered to 4, giving the attacker a win, almost by default. This reflects the fact that the attacker in all but the most unlikely cases would have won the battle on the CM battlefield.
Picking the PzC scenario: Is a really crucial part as it determines what the experience will be like. The one we choose for our Sicily campaign is pretty lopsided, even after the changes that we made to the editor (cutting back on allied strength). We will definitely be more careful about our selection next time around.
Both sides should have an interesting OOB and a reasonable chance to win the scenario. Having a look at the PzC OOB it’s also a good idea to do some initial changes to get better balance for CM battles. Nathangun suggested reduced tank numbers which I think is a good idea. Artillery should also be looked at.
One way to go is to reduce numbers to try and have a very equal force on each side, another way is to reduce numbers but still keep the force ratio of the original PzC scenario intact. I would probably opt for the latter. The scenario length should also be considered as it will take some time to complete (our Sicily campaign is 11 PzC turns which feels reasonable).
Battle length: We have so far gone with an upper time limit of the PzC turn (2h) which then is reduced by the time it takes for the units to move to the battlefield. In the battle that we are about to commence right now the German force moved 4 hexes (4km) during their movement phase up to their jump off point. The specific units move a 12 km/h so 20 minutes are expended moving into position (battle length is 1:40h).
Most battles so far have been about 1h long. If the defending force is not strong enough it will try to withdraw of map, which it’s allowed to do after 30 minutes of combat (in our version of the rules). If the attacker is strong enough and destroys the defender, the battle will obviously end. If both sides are strong enough, the battle will last until times up or if both sides decide to cease fire. We have yet to see the latter happen as our main elements haven’t come into contact yet.
If a battle ends by cease fire or if time is up then the hex will continue to be contested and it will continue during the next assault phase with deployment zones matching the end of the last battle etc (of coruse presuming that one side doesnt move away during the movement phase, or decides not to attack during the assault phase).
An important addition is that if the defenders feels a given assault is to lopsided, no fun etc, then we have it resolved by PzC. But in this case the defending PzC unit’s defense value is lowered to 4, giving the attacker a win, almost by default. This reflects the fact that the attacker in all but the most unlikely cases would have won the battle on the CM battlefield.
Thanks Fizou, food for thought.